@greg - Idling your SUV while you are in Cabela's, built on wetlands. That is what is great about America. Freedom to be a real jerk. Oil revenues fund Al Quida and we have Americans dying in the Middle East, and even on our shores fighting these oil funded elements.. Burn up the gas. And you call yourself an good American. Get real.

@Greg Hey Greg, maybe Cabelas could stake a few Fawns in the parking lot so you can practice hitting deer with your SUV while you shop --- maybe Alfred will clean them for you for a share of the meat (and btw I am a hunter -- but I also think we need to protect the environment --- come to think of it, Ducks Unlimited support wetlands too)

Actually, now we are fighting opium funded elements.

Or, or, or maybe Cabelas could fill in lake Michgan to build a store, we know they will stop at nothing.

Let's see...we went from Cabela's on the swamp next to Lambeau to "Al Quida".

BTW, didn't we take out their veteran QB last year?

I think the main asset is having destinations clustered, rather than having people driving all over the place to separate locations. Less oil used, wet lands saved, our President is gay and everyone is happy.

Those basements flooded long before the development behind the Y.
25 years ago I saw 30" of water on Menomonee Ave, the people may claim it didn't happen before, but it did.

Basements are flooding because of the liberal Norquist boondoggle of the deep tunnel project which does not separate storm and sewerage water. Has nothing to do with swamps that are now not swamps. You lefties are something else, either ignorant, stupid or crooked.

Per the j/s article, its sounds like win/win to me. At the current site 86% of the wetlands will remain and they agreed to 'improve' the remaining wetlands by removing invasive species and building kiosks and an elevated platform to detail conservation efforts. At the new nearby site they will create 2 1/2 times the wetland acreage they removed.

Cabela's shoppers are big outdoors types, that are interested in good stewardship of our natural resources. This sounds like a great demonstration/outreach public/private partnership program, a showcase opportunity for the DNR.

@Jay It is nice to develop new wetlands, but as Kevin pointed out above, when you take away a wetland from a particular location, there are unintended consequences, such as basement flooding.

Especially in Shorewood and Whitefish Bay, we have had real experience with flooding and sewage backup, and now we are creating new wetlands to help offset some of that.

It is not only that there is a wetland, but where it is --- they occur naturally where water tends to collect -- and they are not necessarily wet all the time, but act as a sponge and a filter for when the conditions are right.

They can actually build their development without going on the wetlands, with some changes in the architecture --- why don't they do that?

And why are the Packers, and as I understand Director Bergstrom, so set on this development and using wetlands?

I would have thought that without some billionaire owning the Packers, they would be more sensitive to what they are doing, as they do not need to be greedy.

Wetlands belong to all residents of the state of Wisconsin, that is why we have state (and federal) laws regulating them.

There are economic effects of this project that are of more concern to the folks of Green Bay than they are to those who live in Shorewood, for instance. Like it or not, those need to be taken into consideration when making the proper determination as to how to resolve the issue. We should be willing to defer to the folks who live up there, as they no doubt know the area better than you or I do and can't be assumed to be such rubes that they can't grasp the environmental concepts on their own. Let them handle it.

Alfred is right. Many of the downtown building are built on wood pileings driven deep into the muck. In times of drought, sprinkler systems were installed to prevent the wood from drying out and rotting.

@Alfred --- and Milwaukee has huge flooding and sewage problems --- thanks for making my point.

Mr Tatarowicz, flooding of basements is the direct result of the mismanaged and poorly designed liberal wet dream of the Deep Tunnel Project, has nothing to do with swamps being covered up for people to build homes and earn a living.

Alfred -- Do you even understand the reasons for flooding and the function of wetlands -- or even the preservation of green-spaces to soak up rainwater before it runs off into the storm sewers?

I rather think you do not. Nope, for you it's all about the almighty buck, and once the water has run off your gleaming property or your toilet has flushed, it's someone else's problem to deal with.

Randy unless you want to do away with concrete and asphalt roads, there will always be run off of rain water. The reason for backed up basements of sewerage is because of liberal goofs like you that would not separate the sewerage and rain water, the liberal wet dream of the Deep Tunnel project is too small for such volume. Opine away all day long about swamps, unless you want our roadways to be replaced with swamp land. I have a very large SUV but I still would get stuck.

@Alfred -- I don't want to do away with concrete and asphalt. I just want to use a little intelligence about where we put it. A wetland is there for a reason. Ignore that and you'll have more sewage in the lakes and rivers.

And don't talk to me about the deep tunnel. I don't live there and have no impact at all on Milwaukee County's municipal services.

@Randy... MMSD is not a Milwaukee County municipal service, it is its own entity, with the City of Milwaukee possessing a majority voting control. Most of Milwaukee County is in the MMSD service area, as is much of the area within the very first ring of suburbs in Waukesha, Washington and Ozaukee Counties

All well and good, Jay, but I'm still not a part of it.

@Steve There are always many sides to a story, and I brought out the ones that outraged me --- nice flag you got of Wisconsin there for your logo --- I am sure you will be glad when all the forests are clear cut, the open pit mines are abundant, and the wetlands are all paved over for parking lots

"I am sure you will be glad when all the forests are clear cut, the open pit mines are abundant, and the wetlands are all paved over for parking lots"
You forgot, all the fawns run over by SUVs. Drama queen.

"all the forests are clear cut, the open pit mines are abundant, and the wetlands are all paved over for parking lots"

My dream come true, just think what that would mean! No hippie intervention that leads to job loss and economic downturn. We would have like 2% unemployment in WI, Walker would be even more of a king!

Pave the planet, dill for oil in Lake Michigan. Mine the entire state.

You people do understand that run off from developments will CREATE wetlands? In an area that has a small parcel of undeveloped land, it tends to be the place to divert all run off waters. Only recently ( the past ten years ), have we required developers to create retention ponds to handle run off.
That being said, moving an existing wetland is not a big deal. Most often moving the wetland properly will alleviate issues with flooding of basements, etc., and is better for the ecosystem because of heavy metals and contaminants that have accumulated.

Building this store actually increases wetland acreage.

@Steve - Corporations are people now, per the U.S. Supreme Court. You seem to be trying to date all of them. Patch is not an online dating service. What a love story, Steve + Cabela, kiss, kiss, kiss.

We would, they would not. Do as I say and not as I do is their platform.

Of course Kevin, if we just all agreed with you life would be so grand.

You bring up an excellent point Kevin. I think one of the problems stems from the journalists' lack of writing about all the pros, cons and any other information necessary to tell the whole story in their articles. If all were to do that I think we would have way less arguments and way more thinking things through. The name calling is a childish byproduct of ones habit of jumping to the defensive instead of getting all the facts first. I myself have been guilty of the later, try real hard not to be guilty of the former.

Kevin -
I really liked what you had to say. I really agree too. I'm open to debate but have become so weary or all the arguing. Debate allows for resolution and arguing does not. If so, what's the point? Why do people read these articles than? Just to snipe back and forth calling names? Pointless. Why read if you want to dismiss each other out of hand as a "tree hugger or right-winged Jesus freak? If you want to build on a wetland you're a right winged Jesus freak and if not you're a tree hugger? And all discussion stops because we devalue each others opinions. I am just so leary of politics lately, it's tiring. Is it even possible to look at issues in an impartial way anymore? Look at the merits and pitfalls presented by an impartial presentation (do these even EXIST anymore??). Growing up I remember getting yelled at for asking an adult who they voted for. It used to be private. You didn't discuss it in mixed company because it was personal and people didn't want to offend each other. That sounds kinda nice now.

@Steve Actually I had written about this a long time ago, when Walker first got the special legislation passed to allow the shopping mall on wetlands, after he was lobbied to do so by his business backers and the Wisconsin Realtors Association.

I thought the problem went away when Pro Bass Shops said they do NOT build on Wetlands --- Period !!

Little did I know that the business interests would find a company that seems to have less scruples to occupy the wetlands -- that was a New Development.

I actually wasn't going to write about it again, as I figured that of all people, Hunters, Fishermen, etc. would put pressure on Cabela's and that Packer Owners (aka mostly fans) would not let their Team embark on this environmentally backwards venture --- especially as I see lots of fans in camo at games and I think a large percentage of them are out doors sports people ....

Maybe now people will wake up!

Just to be clear, the JS Online article is from Jan. 28, 2011

Remove your names from the season ticket waiting list... Let's show them who is boss.